An Affair with an older married lady... and the aftermath...

[junior_cannibal]

Originally Posted by Shrouded

I'm sure there's some exceptions to the norm. Maybe I'm just tired on the weekdays due to work and weekends are sometimes equally exhausting.

Bro, you just need to eat more Filet and maybe chicken rice? Anyway, the fun bit is never about the quantity, its about the quality. But still the same word of caution, despite regular checkup, by having multiple partners concurrently, best to use caps for all. Some STD won't show up in symptoms but are contagious.

[84gunner]

Originally Posted by junior_cannibal

Anyway, the fun bit is never about the quantity, its about the quality. But still the same word of caution, despite regular checkup, by having multiple partners concurrently, best to use caps for all. Some STD won't show up in symptoms but are contagious.

Agree.

As we get older, quality matter more than quantity. When we are younger, the energy, drive & curiosity we have, didn't bother that much about quality. In fact, our confidence & ego was also boosted when we had more quantity. As we get older, having experienced more, our curiosity gets lesser, our energy also get lesser (become more precious), therefore better spend our energy on higher quality, hahaha. Similarly, spending our time on matters with better value.

About STDs, beside HIV, I think some STDs have no cure (read the STD threads), despite the advanced technology & medical science today. Therefore, it's better to be safe, rather than regrets later.

[junior_cannibal]

Originally Posted by 84gunner

Agree.

As we get older, quality matter more than quantity. When we are younger, the energy, drive & curiosity we have, didn't bother that much about quality. In fact, our confidence & ego was also boosted when we had more quantity. As we get older, having experienced more, our curiosity gets lesser, our energy also get lesser (become more precious), therefore better spend our energy on higher quality, hahaha. Similarly, spending our time on matters with better value.

About STDs, beside HIV, I think some STDs have no cure (read the STD threads), despite the advanced technology & medical science today. Therefore, it's better to be safe, rather than regrets later.

The ironic thing in life is that, as we grow older, we are more confident to be able to speak with ladies of all ages, make them laugh and feel comfortable, yet we know we are unlikely to be able to have several rounds in a night. Yes, that's where we need to make a choice.
Indeed, some STD have no cure while others can recur randomly. We all need to be more careful.
Even for a one man one woman, monogamy relationship, unless the two were virgin at the onset, otherwise, can't be 100% sure of the past partners.
Be safe than sorry.

[84gunner]

Originally Posted by junior_cannibal

The ironic thing in life is that, as we grow older, we are more confident to be able to speak with ladies of all ages, make them laugh and feel comfortable, yet we know we are unlikely to be able to have several rounds in a night. Yes, that's where we need to make a choice.
Indeed, some STD have no cure while others can recur randomly. We all need to be more careful.
Even for a one man one woman, monogamy relationship, unless the two were virgin at the onset, otherwise, can't be 100% sure of the past partners.
Be safe than sorry.

Agree too.

As we grow older, we accumulate more life experience & thus mental maturity. At the same time, as we progress in our careers, our financial capability grow too, compared to our younger days, thus our confidence grow as well.

But there are some clowns with super huge ego who refuse to learn despite going through the hard way (everything is other people's faults). They want so much face & wanna win very time, pissing off most of the people around, regardless of male or female, hahaha.

I have come across virgin infected with STD:
she went to do eyebrow tattooing, but unfortunately, the needle was not sterilised well enough. A virgin guy can also be infected with STD in a similar way.

[junior_cannibal]

Originally Posted by 84gunner

Agree too.

As we grow older, we accumulate more life experience & thus mental maturity. At the same time, as we progress in our careers, our financial capability grow too, compared to our younger days, thus our confidence grow as well.

But there are some clowns with super huge ego who refuse to learn despite going through the hard way (everything is other people's faults). They want so much face & wanna win very time, pissing off most of the people around, regardless of male or female, hahaha.

I have come across virgin infected with STD:
she went to do eyebrow tattooing, but unfortunately, the needle was not sterilised well enough. A virgin guy can also be infected with STD in a similar way.

Agree 100%.
Those fella think they are the greatest in this planet. Refuse to admit or correct when they are wrong.
About the STD, also must include those who thought virgins are cleaner and safer, pay a shit load for it, unknown to them, its rather common in those days when the young ladies went for a small surgery to replace the hymen or simply insert a blood soaked cotton before sex so that when the fella insert, would get blood.

[Bigbluebird]

Originally Posted by Shrouded

For me the choice was clear. I would have to leave all of them. Hurt everyone and myself in the process and wish none of this ever started.

But that wasn't a choice I was willing to make.

Sorry M, but you knew this all along, just that most times we do not wish to face reality and what comes after. I hope you can handle the aftermath well, someone will be hurt, but they already know about it. So do good by youurself and Jasmine if you both truly wants to be together and not just being dreamy about it.

[junior_cannibal]

We are all grown ups, we just have to be fully responsible for our choice and action.
The ladies when chose to have fun with Mark, whether it's due to he being a very nice chap, with decent dick and skill, they were all aware none of them was exclusive and they were more like using him as a live dildo to satisfy themselves.
If Mark and Has could really put a stop to all these after the latter completes her divorce, whether the two of them get married or not, as long as they stop all open relationship, these ladies just have to move on to find a new FWB or willing live dildo.
On the other extreme, if Mark and Jas continue open relationship, then I will be puzzled what exactly is this so called relationship. At best room mates that share a bed with occasional sex and some emotional connectivity.

[gankokyou]

Hoping for June to join in the sexual romps

[owlette]

Originally Posted by Shrouded

For me the choice was clear. I would have to leave all of them. Hurt everyone and myself in the process and wish none of this ever started.

But that wasn't a choice I was willing to make.

Interesting that bro Shrouded came to the conclusion that the choice of leaving them all to "shorten the pain".

Personally think that its not the choice you should make or even consider as there will definitely be deep regrets and thoughts of "what could it have been if.."

Since Carpe Diem, led you here. I think you should play it out. Much as Jasmine and yourself are unclear of what you two truly want out of the relationship. Until that is clear, you should just enjoy the moments you two share together. At least even if things turn sour, you can tell yourselves that you've tried your best to make things work and that you have no regrets.

Much like theres a strong emotional reliance on you from Alicia and Shirlyn. They eventually have to find their own paths (much like yourself and jasmine, whether as a couple or individually) unless there is a 4 way relationship, which will be very interesting to juggle. Although it does seem like there is a possibility of it working out based on the current situation.

Again, im just voicing my own opinion and thoughts of the situation. even in therapy, the psych is not supposed to give you answers but to provoke thoughts to lead you to solving your own problems.

[84gunner]

Originally Posted by owlette

Interesting that bro Shrouded came to the conclusion that the choice of leaving them all to "shorten the pain".

Personally think that its not the choice you should make or even consider as there will definitely be deep regrets and thoughts of "what could it have been if.."

Since Carpe Diem, led you here. I think you should play it out. Much as Jasmine and yourself are unclear of what you two truly want out of the relationship. Until that is clear, you should just enjoy the moments you two share together. At least even if things turn sour, you can tell yourselves that you've tried your best to make things work and that you have no regrets.

Much like theres a strong emotional reliance on you from Alicia and Shirlyn. They eventually have to find their own paths (much like yourself and jasmine, whether as a couple or individually) unless there is a 4 way relationship, which will be very interesting to juggle. Although it does seem like there is a possibility of it working out based on the current situation.

Again, im just voicing my own opinion and thoughts of the situation. even in therapy, the psych is not supposed to give you answers but to provoke thoughts to lead you to solving your own problems.

I guess bro Shrouded now knows better what he wants in a committed r'ship (marriage), ie, the couple are exclusive to each other, no sharing anymore.

The current sex partners he has don't give him that confidence nor assurance. Probably the possibility is higher with Shirlyn, but her proximity to EoS, ie, sending her pics to him, etc, made Shroulded feel uncomfortable, although at the moment, Shrouded & Shirlyn are not a couple, therefore he has no right to interfere.

And, Shirlyn being his superior at work, that may be another point that he may feel awkward about, unless he's prepared to change to another company.

[owlette]

Originally Posted by 84gunner

I guess bro Shrouded now knows better what he wants in a committed r'ship (marriage), ie, the couple are exclusive to each other, no sharing anymore.

The current sex partners he has don't give him that confidence nor assurance

I think your deduction is wrong leh bro. I believe bro Shrouded himself doesnt know whether he is ready/able to be in a committed relationship/marriage. I think as much as he says that he only wants to be with Jasmine. I'm not sure whether both parties can "adapt" to monogamy. Much like how Jasmine has been "fooling around" with Kate and bro Mark "reluctantly" agreeing to continue with Nat and Shirlyn.

I think that it has nothing to do with his current sexual partners not being able to give confidence/assurance to have a "proper relationship" but more of that Jasmine is different to him. In the sense that she's not just another sexual partner but someone that he wants a "proper future" with, whatever that means.

Take Crystal for example, Jason is her "soulmate". Someone she relies on for comfort and stability but they both still "fool around" outside due to supposed sexual incompatibility. but again Crystal knows that no one can replace the place that Jason has in her heart.

So personally i think Jasmine sees Mark in a similar way as Crystal sees Jason in terms of emotional reliance and being her rock.

[84gunner]

Originally Posted by owlette

I think your deduction is wrong leh bro. I believe bro Shrouded himself doesnt know whether he is ready/able to be in a committed relationship/marriage. I think as much as he says that he only wants to be with Jasmine. I'm not sure whether both parties can "adapt" to monogamy. Much like how Jasmine has been "fooling around" with Kate and bro Mark "reluctantly" agreeing to continue with Nat and Shirlyn.

I think that it has nothing to do with his current sexual partners not being able to give confidence/assurance to have a "proper relationship" but more of that Jasmine is different to him. In the sense that she's not just another sexual partner but someone that he wants a "proper future" with, whatever that means.

Take Crystal for example, Jason is her "soulmate". Someone she relies on for comfort and stability but they both still "fool around" outside due to supposed sexual incompatibility. but again Crystal knows that no one can replace the place that Jason has in her heart.

So personally i think Jasmine sees Mark in a similar way as Crystal sees Jason in terms of emotional reliance and being her rock.

Well, only bro Shrouded knows himself best, need to & can decide for himself.

The other bros & sis here, u & me included, are here more to "listen" & see-show.

Therefore, my guess or deduction is correct or wrong, is not important, haha. And as a 理工男, I have to admit that I'm quite bad at such guessing. For gals that like to play mind-guessing games with me, I'm very likely to disappoint them, hahaha. 1 means 1, 2 means 2. But many gals like to say 1, when they are actually thinking or meaning 2.

Being 理工男 means looking & analysing things from a "technical" POV, example, driving a car, why the car can't start? Is it because battery's flat, or is it because no petrol? or is it defective spark plug? etc etc.

Not because no mood (emotion) to work or do it. Moods / emotions are not technical (理工、技术) factors.

[junebaby]

What a lively discussion suddenly.

Here's what I think.

1. Mark is with Jasmine because she gives him some sort of familiar comfort that he didn't get with Ann, he became confused and maybe lost when she started behaving like Ann by having multiple partners, and encouraging him to sleep with their friends, but he can still feel that she cares for him, like when she went over to his place when he was sick. So he tolerates what she does and wants him to do because he is holding out for the ideal future with her based on how she treated him initially.

2. Shirlyn doesn't actually like Mark at the beginning. She took advantage of him when he's vulnerable maybe because she's horny. Which guy would reject a girl when she makes a move on him? Then she realised that there's more to him, and he cares about her, like when he bought the pregnancy test kit. So in a way, the roles here are reversed when compared to Mark and Jasmine.

3. Nat doesn't need any analysing. Her sex drive is high, Mark is convenient.

4. Alicia is somewhat like Shirlyn I think, initially just using Mark then falling for him because he cared for her and treated her well. But she left because she can't bear to see him with someone else.

5. Crystal, I think she's just repressed. Having a soul mate is good but the lack of sex was probably too much for her to take, especially since she did have her own FWB. I think she was just experimenting with Mark and nothing more might happen between them, especially if she managed to get back with her other guy.

[Shrouded]

I woke up a couple of hours with a naked Jasmine and a clothed Shirlyn on either side of me. My cock felt crusty from Jasmine's juices. Perhaps we should have gone to wash up after sex.

I got off the bed slowly to go take a shower, trying my best not to wake either of them.

A freezing cold shower in the morning would definitely do me some good.

I wondered what I was willing to give up, who I was willing to hurt, in order to secure my own happiness.

In some ways Jasmine and I were too much alike. We both were too concerned about others. That was probably why she felt she could tolerate what her husband had done when she found out. Maybe that was why she wanted to give him a second chance. Then again, if I'd kept my dick in my pants when dealing with a married woman, all this probably wouldn't have happened. I should have just been a colleague, maybe a friend, not engage in what seemed like harmless flirting at the time, and definitely not try to pleasure her knowing she had been sexless for five years.

The common question would probably be if I could turn back the clock, would I do all these again? On hindsight I probably would have not even pursued anything with Ann in the first place. But that was my problem. I craved for the validation. I wanted acknowledgement, or even the slight feeling that someone wanted me. Everyone I'd been with since Ann all exhibited some semblance of that behaviour, and thus I was hooked. And now it was way out of control.

Could I blame Isabelle for this? My low self esteem?

We were supposed to get married, and yet we broke up just because I suddenly felt like I really loved my job and wanted to be in it for the long haul. Of course there's tons of army regulars who are in happy marriages. I'm just an idiot who didn't manage his time well and chose to wallow around in self-pity and doubt. I even left the force despite being guaranteed a career till I retired just because I didn't like the new environment I was posted to.

This job felt like it gave me purpose. A direction. Accelerated promotion even though I didn't have a degree. Was it because I was really good at what I did or because I was sleeping with my "boss"? I guess the testimonial from the healthcare company should be validation enough that I actually could do the job if I wanted to.

I finally turned off the shower. I didn't know how much water I wasted. I wrapped the towel around my waist and exited the bathroom and somehow bumped into Kate who was heading to the kitchen.

K: What did you do to them? They're complete knocked out.

Me: Nothing?

K: I went from having two bolsters to one then none.

Me: I went from none to two. Haha.

We sat down in the living room after I made instant coffee for both of us.

K: I kind of feel sorry for you. Jasmine spends so much time with me and keeps sending you away to pleasure other girls.

Me: Is that supposed to make me feel bad or better?

K: Neither? You guys are just weird la. I thought I was bad for having so many partners, but you guys bring the polyamorous lifestyle to a whole new level.

Me: We just want everyone to be happy.

K: Weird way of doing it though.

Me: Yeah. It is.

K: What happens if one of them gets pregnant? Then what would you do?

Me: Try not to get them pregnant? They're all on the pill.

K: Nothing is 100% safe except for abstinence. And none of you can abstain. Haha!

Me: Well…

K: Anyway, just be there for her when she needs you. Sexually or otherwise.

Me: Right.

K: The question is, how long can you keep this up? Even I'm tired juggling Jasmine and Rebecca. And now Shirlyn is somehow in the mix as well.

Me: What if I leave?

K: Leave who?

Me: All of them. Cut off all the complications.

K: Even Jasmine?

Me: Yes.

K: Don't. She needs you. Trust me.

Me: It's the easiest way.

K: It is. But can you bear the consequences? Jasmine was already hurt badly by her husband and she turned to you. If you leave, you'll just cause her more hurt. You don't want to hurt her right?

Me: I don't.

K: You have a lot of time to work things through you know. Not just with her, but everyone. Jasmine said you brought a girl to meet Nat and Darren. Surely you must have learnt something.

Me: I don't think we're like them. Their circumstances are different.

K: Then learn tolerance. Nobody is perfect, yet we can all get along well because we embrace each other's flaws. What are you so afraid of anyway? What do you have to lose?

Me: I don't know.

K: You have to find out then. Go back to when you first got together with Jasmine and think. What made you want to be with her in the first place? And I'm not talking about sex. Sex should never be the deciding factor. If it was, you'd have too many of them to choose from.

Me: I can't think straight when I'm with them daily.

K: Take some time off for yourself. Go to the beach or something. And just think.

Me: I'll try I guess.

K: You cycle right? Go for a long solo ride or something.

Me: And what if I decide to leave anyway?

K: Then you'll have to deal with the consequences. But I'll say this again. Don't hurt her. She may seem strong but she's not.

Me: Ok.

K: I'm going back to bed. Good luck.

I wondered if I should head back into the room, or just stay in the living room.

In the end, I went back and squeezed between the both of them. They sleepily wrapped their arms around me.

It really wasn't that bad actually. But in the long run, there would surely be other problems.

[bluetooth]

Don’t mistake lust for love.